115 | Sell The Way You Buy w/ David Priemer

David Priemer is the Founder and Chief Sales Scientist of Cerebral Selling and author of the bestselling book, Sell The Way You Buy.

I heard him on another podcast and HAD. To have him on the show because the way he teaches selling is what I wish everyone would do.

This is like sales therapy for me, and you’re gonna love David!

Connect with David!

Website/blog: https://cerebralselling.com/

YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/CerebralSelling

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dpriemer/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cerebralselling/

Book: http://sellthewayyoubuy.com/ (or find "Sell The Way You Buy" on Amazon)

Connect with ME!

Also, I'd love it if you connected with me on LinkedIn or Instagram.

Or shoot me an email at youshould@connectwithpablo.com with the "Heard CEC's Charod" in subject.

This that's a genius email address?  Me too, but I didn't come up with it.  It was the idea of my good friend, and super talented web designer, Nathan Ruff.

If you want your website redone, updated, and managed with unlimited updates for just $250/month (CRAZY GOOD DEAL RIGHT??), go to Manage My Website and hookup with one of the smartest, most talented guys I've ever met- THE Nathan Ruff.

Transcript

David Priemer: 0:00

people ask all the time it's like, how did you build your business? And some of it is like experience and consciousness. And some is like, I just did this and it, I guess it kind of worked. A lot of it is that is that I was just telling my assistant today. I said, it's hard to look back last week and say like, oh, we really moved the ball forward. But if you look back six months a year, All these little things that look like. I remember Seth Godin and I talk, he showed this picture of like planes landing at Heathrow airport. And he was like the runway footage and he's he, they sped it up. And what you saw as these planes coming in for landing. And they were like, like, that's what it looks like when it's sped up. But when it's slow, it looks kind of gradual. So he's like, everyone's course correcting all the time. And you can only kind of see at the end of the day what happened, but it's not a week to week thing where you have a massive breakthrough

Pablo Gonzalez: 2:17

Welcome back to the chief executive connector podcast. I'm your host and chief executive for not three Republicans. All is. And today we've got a guy that I literally just, just started talking to right now. I think he's an awesome, awesome guy, but I heard him talking on a podcast and I found this subject fascinating. His name is David He's the founder and chief sales scientist of cerebral selling and author of the best-selling book sell the way you buy David. Welcome

David Priemer: 2:42

to the show, my man, how you doing? great public. Thanks for having me. That was a great intro, by the way. I'm like all, I'm all pumped up. I got gotta maybe just record that, listen to it in the morning when I get up and just, you know, the good

Pablo Gonzalez: 2:51

news is that it's being recorded, right? You're going to be, how do you like my ability to go from just like chit chat conversation to straight up hype man, voice, without even taking a

David Priemer: 3:00

breath. It's like, you know, like a dog, right? Like, come on, boy, you want to go for a run? And it's like, boom, like they get up and out the door. That's what that's exactly. I love it in the best possible way. I don't mean to

Pablo Gonzalez: 3:12

so good. I do see myself as an adolescent puppy at times, so that works. David, as I, as I warned you, right? My, my podcast centers on human connection. You're, you know, you're a sales guy. You, you get human connection deeply. I have this thesis that the best way for you to connect with somebody is to add value to their life and share vulnerability. So we're going to add a bunch of value in this conversation. I'm going to ask you, you know, what are you, what are you struggling with right now? What's something you struggled with in the past when you started there. And then we'll talk about your, your

David Priemer: 3:39

genius. Oh, I don't know about the genius, but yeah, struggling wise, you know, I think one of the things that a lot of people struggle with in entrepreneurs and I'm no different is just focus and priority, you know, it's, it's the easiest thing. There's a million books on focus and prioritization, but it's the hardest thing to operationalize because we get so distracted. And especially now where, you know, we're all, I mean, you know, we're still in the middle of pandemic and many of us are still quarantining and there's a lot of uncertainty and you know, you're at home and I'm here with my kids and my wife, who's a teacher and everyone's kind of, you know, we're online doing and it makes it difficult, you know, to, to focus. So that's the thing I always struggle with trying to build the business and, and just kind of, you know, keep my head in the game is like, what, what should I be focusing on? That's always a big struggle for me.

Pablo Gonzalez: 4:22

Man. Yeah, totally.

David Priemer: 4:25

Where do we listen to be the topic of the entire time that we should spend together?

Pablo Gonzalez: 4:29

Yeah. Listen, man. And I, it's not something that comes up often, right? Like the number one thing people say is imposter syndrome, right? Like that's like 60 to 70% of people say that focus comes up every, every, every so often, man. And it's, that's my biggest struggle too. Right. Like I, by far right on I've, I've, that's always been my thing like this year is the year of discipline for me. Right. Like I'm trying to, I'm trying to just really zone in on stuff. What are you. have you found any, are you adapting any kind of like tools or methodologies that you've looked into that have helped you kind of like tackle this thing? Or are you still just on the lag match, focus

David Priemer: 5:03

stage? It's an ongoing concern, but I think, you know, so I used to do this and one of the books that I love it, you know, I got a bunch of books behind me. One of the books I'm fanatical about is the book called the one thing the surprisingly simple truth behind extraordinary results. And, and this just this idea of like every day before your spouse, before you start do something, ask yourself, what's one thing I can do. What's the one thing I can do such that everything else I could do would be made easier or unnecessary. And then I borrow a tip from atomic habits, which I you know, book, many people have read that I also like, and it's funny. Cause when I think about like writing a book, so when I wrote my book and it's funny, I don't want to, I'm going to go on just a little weak tangent here. So imposter syndrome. So when you start a business, You know, no matter what experience you have and, you know, and, and how well you think you're set up the first thing that maybe goes through your mind, or like, did my mind, which is, I just want someone to pay me to do anything. Right. You know, it's, it's like, I, it's easy to work for a company and you're part of the machine. But now that it's all about you and your vision, I hope this catches on. And then when you write a book, you write a book almost in isolation and you do all this work to publish the book and who's read it, the editor, who's not your target audience. You know, they're just looking for certain things and you think, I hope you will like this book, you know, and every piece of content you put out, you're like, I hope people let you know. So there's always that not, I wouldn't say imposter syndrome per se, certainly at the, you know, maybe a little bit more at the beginning, but then as, as you put new stuff out into the world, I'll tell you every time I do an email, but this is like between us and no one else is listening. Every time I put out an email blast, you know, like every week or two, and it's going out to thousands of people, I get like a little nervous, you know? It's like, what, what if they don't like this? Or is this going to hit the center of the target for them? Right. So. Anyways. So the thing back to James clear on atomic habits, one of these, after we lost focus there, we didn't lose focus. Yeah. Well, exactly. You know, there's a lot of things bouncing around in my head. Was that, how am I going to write a book? Because you can't write a book in 15 minute increments. Like I can't just sit down and I'll just do like 15 minutes of writing, right? You have to have focus, concentrated time. And so some of the hacks I did, to be honest, you know, I would take my kids to their, you know, their sports and athletic stuff. And I wrote a bunch of the book in the car while I was waiting for them. Right. Like I'm sitting there in my car. There's no, maybe, maybe I'm tethered on my phone, but like there's no distractions, right. Even little things like, you know, removing distractions. So I would have my, my Google docs open in a window, but my emails and other things that were, you know, other tabs in my browser, I would minimize to my doc. So my tendency to alt tab and just, oh, let me just check, check email. I caught myself. So back to the idea of focusing prioritization, it's all about asking yourself, like, what's the one thing. And then also like building a bunker and eliminating as many distractions as you can to save yourself from yourself. Oftentimes.

Pablo Gonzalez: 7:49

Yeah. That makes a lot of sense, man. I do some of my best work on an airplane, right? Like, just like you focus in and you do the stuff that you were normally going to distraction. What was the, what was the one thing for today? What was today's one

David Priemer: 7:59

thing. Oh, you know, so the one thing we were kind of talking about this earlier was was content repurposing. So I have an assistant who helps me with some of my, you know, like she does great work. She takes a moment and videos and kind of chunks it up. And you know, the last thing I want, I don't want her waiting on me. Right. Like I want to make sure that she has enough stuff to work on and that, you know, there's stuff that it's in my inbox that she's waiting on me for that. I tackle that. So that was my one thing for today. I had a number of videos and pieces of content to go through to make sure she's productive. And that's look, when you got a team, that's what you gotta do. That's your job is to clear a clear the way for them to do the thing that they're great at. Yeah,

Pablo Gonzalez: 8:32

man, that waste as, as I've grown my team that weighs heavily on me. Right. Like I, like that's actually made me cause I'm very extrinsically motivated. Right. Like, so as my team grows, I find myself more like, well, I got to do this for the team. Right. Like, as, as opposed to before, I'd be like, eh, we're going to do this, do that. I don't care. Right. Like but that's cool, man. Alright. Let's this is not a therapy. Well, actually it's going to turn into sales therapy pretty quickly here. I love, man. When I heard you, when I heard you talking about selling ha the way that you buy, right? Like that immediately, just that title by itself and the way that you approach it struck deep in with me. Right? Cause I as anybody that loves connection, I'm a communications nerd and the acceptance that it's all about the way that you receive the, the way the person receives the message versus the way that you say it, right? Like it's, it's, that's what it's all about. So selling the way you buy as something that's very natural to me. Can you kind of, can you give me like the brief history of how you got to this point and like what upsets you about the way that people sell that made you start this platform and read this book?

David Priemer: 9:35

Yeah. We'll look like everyone who ends up in sales. I got here by accident. Like no one, because we don't teach it in school. No one says, oh, you should. You know what you should be in when you grow up is you should go into sales. So I got into sales by accident of turn of the.com boom. And I ended up starting my career as a research scientist. I was doing work in engineering at the university of Toronto. We were talking about earlier and I ended up getting into sales. I joined a startup as a sales engineer, and I was fast, instantly fascinated by sales. It was like, okay, why didn't anyone? My guidance counselor, tell me that this is a thing you could do because it combines so many, so many. Wonderful complex systems, right? So many different variables and so many different inputs and outputs. So for me, my engineering mindset was like, this is amazing. But then, you know, as I kind of got we're into sales and I look, I spent 20 years across four high growth startups and three of them ended up being acquired and one was acquired by Salesforce and spent five awesome years. So I love, love, love so much. However, I found that a lot of them, the tactics that salespeople use and that we are in, especially in sales leadership, we're conditioned to promote and they're not unethical. Hopefully, and they're not categorically ineffective, but I just found when I was a VP, for example, at Salesforce, it's the end of the month end of the quarter. And I'm going out and I'm telling my team, you know, Hey look, tell the customers. There's never been a better time to buy. And like now, like every month was supposed to be the biggest month we've ever had. And I love, love, love Salesforce, and again amazing company, amazing team. But then what I would do is I would go back to my desk and because I was a VP at Salesforce, people wanted to sell me stuff all the time. So all of people are salespeople, BDRs are they're in Downing to me and I'm having none of it. Right? Like I'm, I'm not answering the phone. I'm not responding to LinkedIn because I realized I don't like talking to salespeople. Right. Even in sales, people are not bad people by the way, but a lot of salespeople are just executing these old outdated tactics and some of which have been shown to be counterproductive and they're not bad people. They're just doing the thing that they're, their sensei taught them. And so that's kind of where this idea sell the way buy came from, which was the, all these tactics, which were fine. We're just not working on me. And so I thought, well, you know, this is the profession that I love. And when you tell someone you're in sales, you become the enemy. That's not good. So like, how can we be better sellers, more empathetic use tactics that are rooted in, in science that actually work and just be more human. And that's where the idea

Pablo Gonzalez: 11:59

awesome. I would love to, so I'm a huge fan of, I'm a big fan of like category design. Right. and I'm a big fan of people with interesting titles, right? Like I've always made my own title. Right. So chief executive connector is a little thing. you are chief sales scientist, right? Talk to me about, talk to me about how that title fits into AA, your strategy of what you're trying to do and be. Talk to me about the scientific process. Like, are you like hypothesis tests, report kind of stuff on like sales tactics? Like, tell it,

David Priemer: 12:30

tell me about that. Well, I wish I could tell you there was a, some massive grand design to it, but, you know, I didn't feel it was appropriate when I started my business as a, as a, as an army of one to call myself a CEO, you know, founder seemed okay, but, you know, I wanted to communicate what it was I did. And it's funny. So I just like literally one night, because I always. I always thought of myself as like, what does a scientist do? A scientist loves to learn. And that's the thing that I still love to do the most in the world. I love to learn. I love to assimilate new knowledge. I feel like, you know, Kana Reeves in the matrix where he gets unplugged and he's like, oh, I know, come through now. Like I like reading something or learning something and feeling just a little bit smarter that's for me is amazing. And then, you know, I also love to synthesize and I love to, you know, to teach and explain what I know to other people. and and, and that's what I did throughout my academic career and sales career. And so sales scientists seem to, you know, be like a good title. So I just came up with a one night and to be honest, I'll tell you like, it's it's and I'm sure you probably find the same with yours as well. People really like it. And people reach out just to say, Aw, you know, cool title. Right. And so it just, it just kind of stuck.

Pablo Gonzalez: 13:37

I think, I think You know, I've always been just like Huck, Finn kind of character, right? Like, I've just like, as a kid, I always would talk to anybody and I go, Hey, I give you that nickname, whatever, like the power of a nickname, right. Or a title or whatever I think is really, really powerful. Like what you're saying. I mean, whole has held true for me forever. Right? Like I giving yourself, I was telling you about being director of sustainability, right? Like that title didn't really exist when I got my consulting company acquired by my, by my biggest client. and I was like, I just want to be, let's call me director of sustainability kind of thing. And it got me in so many rooms. Right. As a, as opposed to, if I would have been like. green building certification guy. Like it just, it's just a totally different how it comes off as is effective. And I find that really emotionally intelligent people kind of use that trick often. So I'm like

David Priemer: 14:20

fascinated by it. But look, I think your title is a great metaphor for what we're actually talking about in the world of modern selling, which is so much of what we do in the world of business and selling is, is rooted in, well, that's what my boss did. And so that's what I'm going to do. Or you have like, even in training, it's a lot of, well, here's what I did. Here's what you should do. And so it's funny actually, when I train my clients, a common, unfortunate reaction is a lot of them at the end, we'll say. This is great. I thought it was going to suck because most sales training socks, right? Cause it's just some jerk standing about the front of them, talking about how you're going to close your customers and, and they don't want to hear that. And so we get stuck in these ruts of titles and process and sissy I'm Canadian. So as they process titles and process and systems and so on. And when we break out when call ourselves chief chief executive connector and chief sales scientist, it's like, it's refreshing a new for people and more descriptive, and we can do the same thing with how we sell and how we build our businesses.

Pablo Gonzalez: 15:17

I love it, man. So I'm, I'm also a big fan of I've been in a really big marketing rabbit hole. So all of these terms are very, just like I'm a fan of this net strategic narrative, right? Like the idea that old game versus new game. And, and in what you're saying, I hear, I hear a lot of old game versus new games. So I guess I'll ask you in that, in that fashion, because I think it's an effective way to communicate, but what, what was the old game in selling and what is the new game now that, that, that is selling how you're buying? Give me, give me a little bit about

David Priemer: 15:45

that. Well, there's a couple of things. There's just, just tactics in general that we know don't work. it never really worked all that. Well things like what I've referred to as closing tactics, right? So we're at the end of our conversation that you were in the car dealership or whatever it is. And they say, you know Pablo, is there any reason why you don't think you could make a decision today? Right. Even little things like when you're in a retail environment, you walk into like the gap or a store and someone says, excuse me, sir, can I help you find something? W like, what do you say. No, leave me alone. man say, no, no. You know, I'm just looking, right. Because if I say, yes, you can look at some people. Yeah. It's like, I'm giving consent for you to do your sleazy sales stuff to me. Right. And these are the things that we use to, to teach people, to do, to kind of corner people and limit their ability to choose freely. But we now know that that produces an emotional reaction, the mind of our customers of resistance. And so these are some of the scientific principles we found that, that have kind of flipped the switch, but also one of the, and that's just, you know, irrespective of how people buy, but also today with the advent of the internet and, you know, sites, Amazon and TripAdvisor and all that kind of stuff, the way we buy is a lot different. And you know, everyone's heard, oh yeah, people are way down the sales cycle. Even before they contact a sales rep, they try to find as much as they can. So buyers are educated. There's so many more solute forget like, you know, 10, 20 years ago, five years ago, I talked about this in my book in 2011. There was 150 vendors in the marketing technology space. Okay. 2020, and then it comes out in April every year. So we're almost due for like a new, new survey over 8,000 vendors. So in addition to all of the, kind of, you know, the, the, the the, you know, the the choice that's out there and kind of the way people now, you know buy and the way they think, and the tactics people use it's in the peer reviews, the world of buying has changed so much so that when we think about tactics, we have to use tactics that are not only rooted in scientific principles, the way people think and buy and react, but also for the environment that we find ourselves in. And those are kind of the two biggest things that have changed the landscape in selling.

Pablo Gonzalez: 17:48

Dude environment is so important, man. Like for me, it's like context is 95% of it. All right. Like what's, what's, what's been the change in the environment. Like what do you, what do you see in the environment that has to make us adjust the psychology of the tack or the tactics according to the same psychology?

David Priemer: 18:02

Right. Well, like I said, one of the biggest things is just the sheer number of solutions in the market, in any given category. So that's like problem. One problem. Two is most of us are also, let's say in the, even in the technology space, coming up with new and innovative products and services that people have never seen before, and that the ability to start a company and to create a product is, is easier in the best possible way. I said that easier to be than it's ever been before. Like you can spin up a product venture money is easier to get than it was 10, 20 years ago. And so the barrier is very low, but what you end up with is that people that fall in love with their product that have a very difficult time explaining to someone else what it is they do. So that's the second thing. And the third thing is. Just distractions, especially. And I think it's definitely come out in the last year or so there are so many things that we're focusing on. Right? And so most of our customers spend a fraction of a percentage of the time giving a crap about what it is that you do, right? And so, while you think you are the star of your own movie in the center of the universe, your customers don't care. So all of these things are, are, are kind of conspiring against us, which is why we need different approaches and tactics to connect with customers. And, and I, it's not fancy, not like subversive or subliminal, just human tactics. And that's the idea of where sell the way you buy comes from. It's like, just understand the way people make decisions in this environment and align your sales, marketing motion accordingly

Pablo Gonzalez: 19:31

Listen, I very much echoed with all of that because you just described me to a T, right? Like I'm, I'm, I'm like, I am I'm so in love with my product. And yet I think that I am. For whatever reason, either over communicating it or under, you know, like I, like, I, I have a lot of conversations that go from, this is brilliant to, this is not for me. Right. So I would love to, I would love to dive into it, man, if you're, if you're up for it, right? Like you, you, you train teams and whatnot. Right? So like how would you start? Like what should I start thinking about analyzing? Like what what do I need to be? What questions do I need to be asking myself right now?

David Priemer: 20:08

Yeah. Well, the, you know, there's kind of two things that bounce around in my head. Number one is not falling in love with the product, but rather falling in love with the problem, because that's what your customers think about every day. They don't give a crap about your product. They think about their problems, even, you know, they might, and they have problems that are, are hidden, that they're latent. And then when you call them out, it's like, if you ever seen a really good infomercial, I love infomercials. By the way, whenever you see a good infomercial, you start the show thinking, ah, whatever this is, I don't need it. And then by the end, you're thinking, oh my gosh, how did I live without it? Because they focus just as much on the problem that you're trying to solve. You know, you trying to lose weight, get in shape, get healthier whatever it is it, you know, so that's the, you know, the first thing they focus on the problem more than the product, and then what they also do. And in terms of like communicating our value is we use like emotionally charged words and terms to, to kind of, to elevate that problem, to the point where our customers have to pay attention. And again, we do this in a very human way and the way we do that is by focusing on the problem, but also. What our customers value and buy. And I think value is a term that gets grossly overused. And what I mean by that, and we, and I'll just drop this and then we can, if you want to go deeper, cause I could go on like this for hours value. So one of the things I talked about, my content and my book, which is a huge thing that salespeople, especially leaders get wrong is value and return on investment are two completely different things. So we go out and, you know, as sales leaders, we go out and we tell our teams, go sell value, go sell value. And really what we're meaning to say is go sell the return on investment. If you invest money in Pablo and his business, then you will either make more money than what you had to give Pablo, or you will save more money. Then you gave Pablo or some combination thereof. Right? And, and we think we'll like, if, if we present this very logical case, then it's going to move people to purchase. You would be stupid not to spend this money with me, if you're going to get this return on investment. But the reality is that is not how people buy. People do not buy based on logic and reason and return on investment. They buy based on feelings. And so if you've ever put together a return on investment or business case to a customer like every salesperson has had this situation where they put together a business case for the customer, they look at it and they say, The customer is never going to believe this, the ROI is too fast. You know, the, you know, even though we're using these right assumptions, like I got to put something more reasonable together and I say, well, what's that now we're massaging the business case to do one thing to make the customer believe it, right? Believe that that eventuality, that outcome is going to be brought about. And the last time I checked belief is a discretionary feeling and not an objective statistics. So you want to get good at describing what you do, focus on the problem, right? Number one. And then number two, really focus on the discretionary feelings of value that your buyers are paying for and focus your message on that

Pablo Gonzalez: 23:10

amazing dude. Amazing. I'm like sitting here nodding my head and giggling cause it's so good. so. I'm in love with my, I definitely market my problem. Right. That's very a category design thing, right? Like, and, and I've been working on that one, like I've been working on how to phrase that problem before I would talk about relationship scaling. Now I kind of talk about it in this old game versus new game of in the past. You know, the more people are used to seeing your sales person as the number one thing that, that you interact with in order to find out about the company, but ever since the advent of social media and, and since 2008, now, as consumers, we are trained to understand that, you know, as much as we want before we actually engage even down to dating, right? Like even like, that's what Tinder is, right? Like you are finding out everything about people or, or, or, or, or making or LinkedIn, right. Like you could check me out before you could decide whether you want to respond to my DM or not. Right. And, and we are still creating this friction of that. Right. So my answer is. A live weekly show where you make this content, you interact with people that they can come, no friction, you can be building relationships and then create all this content that becomes another way to contextualize and learn. Right? So that's, that's the first thing that I, that I talk about now. and I call it the relationship flywheel. And then, and then I describe it, you know, in, in the methodology. Right. I generally end up getting to the point where they're like, this is amazing. Oh man. I just don't know if I have time. Like I you know, th this it's usually a time thing. They, they usually say I'm focused on a couple of other things. I don't know if I can take this on right now when I'm saying this will, you know, This takes three hours a week, and then boom, you have your business development edge, right? So like what can you, is there anything that you can discern from that on like how to do that better?

David Priemer: 25:01

Well, even, you know, if I can, if I can be so bold, even the way you, you started describing what you do, it's like, oh, there's, it's this weekly webinar, this weekly thing. And we, you know, that's what you do. It's almost like, think about how would you describe what you do if I told you that you need to get 75% of the way through your pitch before you can even talk about what it is like you actually do. Right? So I might say, so what do I do. I train salespeople. That's what I do. But there's a million people that train salespeople why should you care about, you know, working with me? So I start falling in love with the problem. I say, look, you know, look, sales is hard and it's gotten harder than it's ever been. People are distracted. They don't want to hear from a salesperson. You're the enemy. In fact, the data, you know, supports that there's a lot of bad salespeople out there, but I'll tell you a lot of these bad salespeople. They're not bad people. They're just using old outdated tactics that were taught to them by someone else. Right. I believe you want to be successful in sales. In the modern era, you have to use tactics that are rooted in science and empathy, right? Because people love to buy things, but they hate talking to salespeople. I now I w I just went on like a 15, second narrative there without describing what I actually do at all. And if you believe what I believe you, if you buy into like selling is harder than ever before, people are distracted. People don't want to hear from a salesperson. You're the enemy. You know, there's a lot of bad tactics out there, but not bad people. People love to buy things, hate talking to salespeople. Now you're leaning in and you're saying, Tell tell me more about this. Right? And in my last company, we were all about advocate marketing, not so far away from what you do. And what we would say is, I mean, look, they've said, look, no one bought anything risky or expensive because of an email that they got from your company, talking about this white paper that you have, okay. People don't want to hear people don't want to hear from your marketing department, conversion rates on marketing and so on, are dropping. And yet the data tells us, for example, the Edelman trust barometer, which is report, I left to site every couple of years, they come out with this. One of the things that people value in terms of opinions, more than anything else is the opinion of someone like them. That's why, you know, all of these peer review sites and so on are so powerful. So the question is in your organization, what are you doing to amplify the voice of your customer and in an authentic way. Right. And put someone in front of your customer. They actually want to hear from that's what we do. And I'm just, I'm paraphrasing you here. Right. And so the fact that it's a weekly webinar, it's a, it's an event who cares what it is. Right. I mean, I'm being facetious. Right. But the most important thing is I need to fall in love with the problem. And by the way, if you're selling, who are you selling to? Are you selling to marketing leaders or business owners? Yeah.

Pablo Gonzalez: 27:43

Yeah. Business owners and, and you know, revenue leaders. Right. So VP of sales, CML, you know, stuff

David Priemer: 27:49

like that. So getting in the head of those people and thinking, well, what is it that they value even I'll go, I'll go so far. Like, think about this. Why would someone invest in sales training? Okay, this is what I do. Why would someone invest in CIT? Why would you, why are you paying me money to come in to your team? Now look for some people like the obvious answer is I'm going to teach your team some new tactics and strategies and so on, and it's going to have an impact on their conversion rate. They're going to sell more business. They're going to convert more customers. Yeah. And there is boom, there's your ROI, but why else would you invest in sales training? Well, maybe as a company bunny, you've never invested in sales training before, and you know, what's happening. People are leaving your company and they're telling you on the exit interview, that we're leaving. because you never invested in us. Right. That's another reason, another reason why people are, are isolated. People are at home. They're on zoom meetings all day. They need something new and different and something that shows them that their companies are investing in them. Right. Or maybe, you know, maybe I'm in charge of sales enablement, or sales training and nothing. I've done. None of the projects that I've spearheaded in the last couple of years. Have been effective. The sales team hasn't liked them and I'm going to lose my job if I don't bring in something that the team actually likes. All of those reasons are reasons why people invest in sales training, but we tend to just focus on one of them. Right. It's like, that's our default go-to. So for you or anyone who has a business, you have to think of the things that your customers value in terms of like a larger spectrum. And what is it about that person or their role or their company look in the pandemic. You might be working probably with some customers that are just hanging on and are going to go out of business unless you swoop in to help them. Okay. And what's the ROI of that in many ways, it's partially immeasurable right? So really thinking about like, what is your customer value? How has that value changed over time? How has it changed in the last year and how are you aligning your sales motion accordingly,

Pablo Gonzalez: 29:45

dude, I'm hearing you, man. This is really, really, really good. It's it's, it's fascinating to me how the carpenter has shitty cabinets. Right? Like, I I'm so good at positioning, something like that for somebody else. And I'm like, what you're describing is literally the methodology of how we design what the show is going to be about. Right. Yet I can't figure it out for myself kind of thing. So like getting you to tell me that from the outside, like it's, it's, it's wonderful, man. I really, really, really good advice. And as I, and as I think about what, what you're saying, what I'm thinking in my head is, okay, these are people buying. So when I talked to the COO, I'm probably going to be talking about all of this content that you get to play with. When I'm talking to the business, you know, the, the, the sales leader, I'm talking about, dude, your salespeople, aren't gonna waste time talking to people that aren't actually going to buy, like they're gonna crush their conversion. And what I struggled the most with is what I. When I'm talking to the business owner, right? Like the business owners, like, oh yeah. But that isn't my salesperson to do that. Or is it my marketing person doing that? And I'm trying to, and I'm like in this part, what's that going to enable both of them, but what would you think that the benefit to that, I guess it would be the investing in them. It would be the feeling supported. Like what, what, what do you think the, the angle to approach the business owner on who has on CMO and has a VP of business development. And they're the final decision when the other two below them have bought in.

David Priemer: 31:02

So I guess the question is what does that and by the way, you're totally right to think about. And I, I say this as well, when people describe what they do, the way you describe what you do, depends on two things. Number one, who's asking. Right? So my wife, God bless her. She's a teacher. When her teacher friends asked me, so, David, what do you do. Like, oh, I train salespeople, right. Because I know they don't care. They're just trying to put me in like a box. Right. They're trying to label me, but when a VP of sales asked me what I do, I might answer that question differently. So the question is, you know, who's asking and then what product am I positioning? Cause I might have lots of different products. Right? You might have different products and services. So, so people sometimes think that they need to come up with like the one statement to describe what they do. That's going to rule them all the best elevator pitch when reality is, it just depends on who you're talking to. And it's okay to actually withhold that statement. So in the case of your question about the business owner, you know, is there a blanket statement that every single business owner is going to care about? Maybe not. Right. So, and it's actually, okay. Cause even in a discussion, I can learn a little bit more about you before I bring out my statement. Like, imagine you were a personal trainer. And someone comes in looking for personal training. You wouldn't start out by saying, oh, like you, you, you would look them up and down and say, okay, you look pretty fit. You look like your bed, this stage, let me guess here's what you're here for. Right? Like you would say no, like what brings you in, you would learn a little bit about what you think, you know, you're developing this hypothesis of what they could use, what they're telling you, what they're not telling you. And then you can lean in. So to your question about the business owner, it really all depends. You know, like sometimes you have a business owner that's very hands-off is actually something I've learned over the course of time with many CEOs that I've worked with in my businesses. Some of them are just very happy to delegate and like, you know, they're, they're just, the team runs everything and some have the final saying in every single decision. So you just have to start out by asking, like, who, who are you dealing with here? Right. And then tailor it.

Pablo Gonzalez: 32:56

So good, man.

David Priemer: 32:58

I seem to say, it's easy to say, man, that's easy to say. You know, harness the

Pablo Gonzalez: 33:03

right, like you gotta, yeah, listen, man. I was just listening to my buddy, Jerry McNamara is like presentation about building accountable culture and it's like, everything you said. And I was like, yeah, duh. Yeah, duh. But it's like, no, but it's putting it together and doing it. Right. Like, you know, and I wasn't saying you had done like the spectrum, but I was just like, yeah, of course. Right. Like, but like listening to it again. I was like, oh man, this is really good stuff. So it's the same as what you're saying. Right. People. People like me need people like you to reinforce and, and, and to continue to like contextualize and clarify until it lands. Right. And I get to the one iteration where I actually nailed. Right?

David Priemer: 33:34

No look, you're absolutely right. you know, as I say, in my it's funny, so as I say, what, usually when I start my training with my clients, as they say everything that I'm going to talk about here today, it's not, nothing's going to be rocket science. You know, like some things you might be hearing for the first time, but you'll, you'll figure it out. It's like you ever watch the Olympics. I know we have the Olympics coming up, you watch the Olympics and you see what they're doing. And there's actually quite a lot of sports. You're like, I can do that. Like I, you know, I can do that. And of course, if you tried to do it, you would really hurt yourself, but it looks simple enough when they do it. Right. And selling is the same thing. Like, it sounds really simple. There's lots of books on how to focus and how to lose weight and get in the best shape of your life. But that knowing, doing gap. It's very real. And I tell people, I say, it's okay to suck. When you learn a new tactic, you're going to try to go and use it with a customer and it's going to fail and you're going to suck for a little while until you get better. And that's okay. Like that's what we all have to help pick each other up and keep giving each other advice. I

Pablo Gonzalez: 34:31

love it, man. I love it. I want to, I want to pick your brain on, you know, we we've talked about this before the call, but you are a sales guy growing a company. What is your, you know, and we talked about the role of content in, in, in your business development efforts. Can you kind of describe to me the role of content in your business development efforts? And then we can kind of dig into that.

David Priemer: 34:54

Yeah, well, I mean, for me, content is everything for a number of reasons, number one, I'm a small business. I'm mostly, you know, one guy. So in order for me to touch other people, I can't rely on me being in front of everyone. So there's the content. Number two you know, a lot of these, these topics I talked about, some of them are new and different and interesting. And so so I, I put that content out in the world because it acts like a magnet, almost like a lightning rod saying like, here's what I believe. And if you believe what I believe, then, then we're going to work really well together. So it's a great, you know, nevermind, you know, in terms of creating interest, it's a great business development tool to get like-minded customers, you know, raising their hand and also part of my mission. Is to do what I can to, to change the world of sales. And I can't do that just one guy. Right? So, so, so the content is, you know, it's all about reinforcing that. The thing that sometimes I struggle with, not, I wouldn't say struggle, but it's always like a, is a, is a thing I think about people consume all sorts of different types of content. And I find, you know, I can blog and people love the blogs and some people are religious YouTube videos. I recently released the audio book version of my book. So if you feel like listening to six and a half hours of me reading my own book by all means, and the sales of the audio book are almost on par slash outpacing the print book because there's a fanatical audience out. There are people who just listen to audio books. So the question is always, well, what content should I make sure they kind of sprinkle it around? Should I focus on one thing, you know, should I focus it on specific medium? Is there a best way to share it? You know, once it's there. so these are the things that, you know, they in this evolves of course over the course of time,

Pablo Gonzalez: 36:30

So I would tell you to think of it as the same thing we're talking about it's context, right? Like all these, all these different things you described are different contexts and everybody it's like language or culture. Right? So like some people speak YouTube. Some, some people speak Instagram means some people speak LinkedIn clips, some people speak blog, right. To me, it's, it's no different than getting your book translated into 30 languages. Right? Like, so, so the key, the key for me of. What works best in content is find your voice and then just recontextualize all of it because it, you know, people listen to different ways right now, as you're, as you're speaking I'm happy that you came out with the audio book. Cause that's how I consume content. Right? Like my, my, my ability to read your entire book is 30% of my ability to listen to your book. so, so now I'm super in, but that's, that's fascinating that you, that you see it that way. And the beauty of it, you know, this is why I want to kind of teach you my content repurposing thing, right? Like, like the beauty of it, it's only going to get easier and easier to, to not have to worry about the cross context off, right? Like there's plenty of now, like repurpose and context companies that are come up, the editing software is getting better and better and better and better, which I think is, is encouraging them. Cause I, I agree with you. I think that what's always. I've always said I'm a world-class opener and a mediocre closer. Right? Like I like, I'm real good at getting it into the top of the funnel. Right. And it's always just being how much. How often can you show up in someone's life and how much, you know, how, how memorable are you when you do it? Right? Like if, if, if those things go

David Priemer: 38:08

up, right, I'll tell you there's I think there's some, you know, sales trainers and sales, you know, gurus, you might call them that I don't particularly care for that. We won't talk about. However, I do believe that we can learn something from everyone. And so there's a fellow. I won't, I won't mention him. but I actually don't mind him too much. He trains a car dealership, salespeople. And one of the things that I saw him talk about in a video was he said, you know, one of the mistakes you, why don't you say, well, I don't know what the loser sales, the car salespeople do. They want referrals. Right? So what do they do? They wait until the person buys the car. They're about to drive off the lot. And they say you know Pablo. Do you know, anyone else who might be looking to buy a car, you know, and Pablo's thinking, this is not what's top of mind for me right now, but sure I'll send me whoever I got your way. Right. And then, you know, you, then they drive off and they disappear and maybe you see them, you know, every now and then when you take your car to the dealership or whatever it is, it's like, you know what the top car salespeople do. They stay in there. Exactly what you said. They stay in their customer's life. Right. They keep adding value there. It's not just, oh, Hey, are you ready for a new car? They ask questions about the car. They remember their birthdays. They not an intrusive or creepy way. They're helpful. They're always there. And now when my friend Pablo says, Hey, do you know anyone I'm looking for a car? Well guess who's there. The person who's been in my life the whole time. So that's part of the thing with content, as well as just. Being around. Right. And being, you know, to the extent that you're not being recognized for just being a name, but being recognized as someone who actually puts out helpful stuff. Like we talked about the power of reciprocity, helpful stuff that aligns with your target audience is a great way just to stay in people's lives. Right. And then when they need you, you're you've always been there

Pablo Gonzalez: 39:52

hundred percent, man. I totally agree. It's to me, it's that final conversion point. Right. But I think, I think that the bigger the funnel, the top of the funnel is the better you're going to do on the bottom of the funnel at the end of the day, it's perfectly correlated. Right. you, you said you were telling me a story. Do you want to talk about it? This psych the, the, the most ROI you've gotten out of the stuff that you were doing in Salesforce? Sure. I'd love to dig into like what that was.

David Priemer: 40:17

Yeah, well, so part of my backstory is that one of my startups was acquired by Salesforce and that's how I got to work there. And I was there for five awesome years. I love my experience at Salesforce, but I've also been a Salesforce customer a few times. And you know, a lot, sometimes they can't help it, but a lot of the events that they do in the content, there's like a punchline, right. And the punchline is, you know, we're talking about the future of a, B and C. And look, I, you know, I don't want to single out Salesforce. A lot of companies do the same thing, which is they come to this webinar to learn about the future of whatever. What's a topic, you know, top of mind in the market today. And then it's kind of like a thinly veiled product page. Like at the end, there's like we're and the customers are waiting for that pitch to come. Right. And so when I was at Salesforce, one of the things I said was, I said, look, I've been a Salesforce customer. A bunch of times, I love working here, but there's lots of things that we can do to add value to our customers that don't involve, you know, pitching a product or having a punchline at the end. And so one of the things that we did, we used to, I used to run small business sales for the Eastern us. So we would go to various cities throughout the US and, and oftentimes cities where we didn't have an office, you know, like we had offices in New York. And, and so we'd go to Cincinnati, we'll go to Columbus, Ohio, you know, and we Pittsburgh, and we would pull together these customer dinners. And what we would do is we would invite, you know, 10 to 15 C-level executives from our customers. And we said, look, the focus of the dinner was just to talk about, you know, kind of what's top of mind for all of us to share, to expand our networks and so on. And of course they're probably showing up to these dinners saying, okay, there's probably going to be like a pitch somewhere but whatever free dinner on Salesforce, why not? And so they would show up. And it's funny, we were talking about the book. The one thing, what I would do is I would buy a copy of the one thing. For all of the executives at the dinner. And I would say now for me, like it was a, it was a, it was kind of a good opportunity because I was a Salesforce customer just like them. And I was acquired by Salesforce. So a lot of people like that story. And I said, look, I, you know, I struggled with focus and prioritization. We talked about this at the beginning of the show, full circle all the time. And I know, you know, as a, as an entrepreneur, I did. And I'm sure as you, as executives leaders at your company, you struggle with the same thing as well. And so let's have a discussion about focus and prioritization. Here's one of my favorite books. We had a quote, this is the formula. We had a quiet discussion, two, three hours of dinner. There's no one talking over each other. We do drinks at the beginning. No one's talking over each other. We go around the table. Everyone says their piece. We, we, we comment and help that person move and we move on to the next one. Those were the highest ROI events that we did. Meaning the most revenue came from those customers that have any other event, I think, including Dreamforce, we did. and why. Because it wasn't, we were, and by the way, we said, we do not want to talk about Salesforce at these dinners. And of course, you know, when you sell, tell people not to, they kind of talk about it a little bit, but what happened was they, we added so much value to them. They had so much affinity for Salesforce that they lent, they leaned in and they said, well, okay, either we earned the right to talk more about our product. And I'll tell you the reps that service these customers told me, they, they would say like, look, you know what? The best thing about these events were the customer took my call when I called them at the end of the quarter to get the deal done. And I wanted the signature. We had added so much value. They took my call. And so my advice to everyone out there, and this goes part and parcel, it's all. Self-reinforcing Pablo like the content. Well, just add value. I don't gate any of my content. You go to my channels, my like, you don't even have, you don't have to even give me your email. Right. Just, I want to get the content out there to add value. And then, you know, people reach out to me and they, and it's almost like, like I said, I've been in their life the whole time, adding value. They're playing my videos at their team meetings and it's a great way to start the relationship. So my advice to you, you're thinking about, and this is what probably you're doing in your business. You're adding value to your customers in a there's no pitch at the end, you know, there's a an arm's length. Hey, look, you know, these people that we're talking, they're not customers of ours all the time. Like they're thought leaders or people just add value, add it's it's, it's the, it's the, the biggest marketing secret that everyone knows about it. Right. And that's what worked for us at Salesforce. It's

Pablo Gonzalez: 44:20

so funny, man. Cause I, I, you know, I've parachuted into marketing, right? Like I, I just been, I went from exec operator guy to business developer guy, but really it all came from this period in my life where I got really involved in nonprofits and the nonprofit game is very, just like in a room networking all the time. And that's when I realized I'm like, oh, wait a minute. First of all, the most influential people in town are the people on the boards of nonprofits. So it's the people that give the most are the most influential people in town. And. The only way you create relationships. Right? Like my ACE Ventura stick ran out. Like, you know, it had a real shelf life into my early thirties. Still works a little bit, but just doesn't have as wide an audience. But it was, you gotta add value, man. So like really, really it's been, it's been amazing to me that it came from just very, just networking kind of strategy, whatever that's that's now what's being translated into sales and marketing. Right. Like I, like, I think the more, the more that we are. Exposed to real truths via the internet, the less we like anything other than the best stuff. Right. So it's like you expect people to add value to your life, right?

David Priemer: 45:30

Yeah. And, and, and especially now, during periods of adversity, people don't have the mental bandwidth, their tolerance. Actually, I feel like there's a process of natural selection happening where a lot of these tactics are dying out faster. That's actually, I think one of the reasons why a lot of people are investing in sales training, because they're realizing that the stuff that used to work a year ago, isn't working as much anymore. As people kind of open their eyes to the fact that they don't want any more distractions. They only need people in their lives with everything going on that are just going to help. Right. And people will remember, by the way, people will remember how you treated them. Like if you've ever been in like a tough. Position in life or you were injured or going through something, you will always remember how people treated you during that time. And now as a society, we are collectively moving through a similar time period, and people will have long memories. It's actually, it's a physiological, biochemical reaction that we have. I won't get into the science of it, but it's designed to help us figure out how to get out of tricky situations as, as, as like, as animals essentially. And so if you treat people poorly, now they will remember when this is all over

Pablo Gonzalez: 46:37

full circle, back to the science sales guy. Right. I feel

David Priemer: 46:41

fascinating. It's bad. There's so much. It's so

Pablo Gonzalez: 46:43

good. That's that? That was excellent, man. Can we, can we move into the lightning round? You ready for the lightning round, but what is your favorite restaurant in? What city is it and what do you order.

David Priemer: 46:56

Oh, you know, okay. You know what? This is, you know, I always love these visceral reactions. So so there was a restaurant, we went to many times it was called the big rock chop house. And it was in somewhere in Michigan. I think it was like in Dearborn, Michigan, we were doing a lot of work with automotive companies. And so we were there a lot and it was just, you know, I fantasize about this place. We weren't there. That's been a lot of great restaurants, but you know, top of mine, it's called the big rock chop house. I think it was in Dearborn, Michigan.

Pablo Gonzalez: 47:24

Nice. What'd

David Priemer: 47:25

you? What do you order there? I ordered the F you know, the, the filet and the thing I remember the most was the, the Bearnaise sauce. It was, I think it was the first time I had Bearnaise sauce and just absolutely delicious. So I, I don't know if it's still around, it's been a long time, but you know, that's, that's the first thing that comes to mind. Oh,

Pablo Gonzalez: 47:40

man. I don't know. I don't know a lot of red meat, but right now you got my, you got my mouth watering. All right, great. What kind of content are you most into right now? This could be what Netflix and chill series you're into, or like what book you're reading or who's who's, who's your favorite podcast person that you're following? Like what content are you most like going to right.

David Priemer: 47:58

My primary source, it depends if you're talking about business or non-business content, my primary source of non-business content is YouTube. I actually don't watch a lot of TV. I'm not a, I'm not a higher holier than that. Don't get me wrong. I got Netflix and Amazon prime and Disney, but I got all of that stuff from my family, but I just love the way that YouTube curates things for me. It's just, it's my, that's what it's designed to be. It's my TV. And I, you know, I don't mean to. Influence anyone else I invested in the YouTube plus? or what is it? YouTube premium, no commercials. It's a game changer. It's like every time it comes on, I'm so blissfully happy with my investment, but, but that's, that's the primary. I, you know, YouTube is my primary thing for content. I obviously do a lot of reading you know a podcast every now and then articles. I'm a sucker for the science of everyday, you know, things that we do in everyday life. I love figuring things out, so it looks some of the stuff I follow, even on YouTube or like lock pickers. I love watching a barbecue people that do barbecue. I'm not a big barbecue guy, but I love watching other people do it. So I just love, you know, recipes, cooking shows I love to cook. So, you know, YouTube is my primary source of of content.

Pablo Gonzalez: 49:05

Awesome man. Great description. any, any really good particular book that you said you read a lot and he really good book that you've read lately that you'd recommend for business or personal development or anything like that.

David Priemer: 49:15

Yeah. I mean, it's funny. Like I don't read any fiction, you know, you can, you can criticize me all you want for that. I don't, I believe in the value of fiction, but I only read you know, nonfiction books and one of my favorite books continues to be Dan Pink's book to sell is human. I thought it was fair. I thought it was a great mix of kind of, you know science and sociology great synthesis of of modern selling. you know, and so if you could read one book, that's what I would probably say, but I'm also big Simon Sinek fan. I have this poster on the wall behind me. People often ask me what this is. This is actually a flip chart that Simon Sinek used on stage at an event that I was at a number of years ago. He signed it for me. anyways, so I love Simon Sinek stuff and I love leaders eat last actually is my favorite Simon Sinek book start with wise. Great. But leaders eat last. I love as well as the science of leadership. I find fascinating.

Pablo Gonzalez: 50:02

Did you walk up to Simon Sinek after the presentation to say, can I get one of those slides and sign it for me did you buy that thing at an auction or something?

David Priemer: 50:08

No I didn't buy It no So so this was an event, it was called sales machine in 2016. So this was, I was back at Salesforce and it was a co-production of Salesforce and an organization called sales hacker. And so the organizers of the event. So I was kind of in the hive at Salesforce. And so the organizers of the event knew I was a big Simon fan. So after the after the talk, which by the way, so he has a book called the infinite game that just came out like, you know, a year or so ago, but he. You know, five years ago, riff that talk on stage because Seth Godin kind of, you know, go to them into doing it backstage. And this is what, you know, the, the, the narrative was, but the organizers gave me the flip chart and and I, I waited in line to meet Simon because he was doing a book signing and so on, and he signed my copy of leaders eat last. And I walked up with his flip chart and I'm like, do you mind, if you like, can you like, sign this for me? And then of course I had to like take it all the way back on the plane. And like, I couldn't put it in the overhead storage bin, but but yeah, it was just, you know, the, the organizers know I'm Simon fans, they

Pablo Gonzalez: 51:06

gave it to me. Do you get to tell that story That's epic, dude.

David Priemer: 51:10

That's amazing. So I actually have, if you go on my YouTube channel, which is, if you just look up cerebral selling, which is the name of my business on YouTube, I made a video about this Christmas Eve 2018. The title of the video is called what's that thing on the wall behind me. So you can look it up and it tells the story in that it's got some video clips of that, that event with Simon. Really cool.

Pablo Gonzalez: 51:29

What is something that you were sure about in your twenties that you no longer believe?

David Priemer: 51:36

That's a good question. Sure. About in my twenties. I don't know. I think, you know, maybe that, you know I th I'd say the biggest thing I have an appreciation for now is just the fact that you have to do what you're passionate about. You know, I don't think I had a full, clear sense of that in the twenties. And I know everyone says that, but I think one of the things that I, I value extremely a great deal now is authenticity because people can tell, like, people can tell if you don't believe in your product, they don't believe what you're selling. I even joke. Sometimes I say, you know, when my kids, I got three kids when they come to me and they're about to hit me up for something like they want to lift. Like I can tell like immediately, just by the way they, cause they're being inauthentic. Right. And so, you know, I think you know, one of the things that, especially now, when there's a million solutions out there and there's so many distractions, like just, just be authentic, you know, I didn't fully appreciate the value of that back in the day and just, just doing what you're passionate about, because if you do it will come out and other people will see it and believe it and they'll feel it. And when they feel it, you know, it just makes everything so much. easier

Pablo Gonzalez: 52:44

Amen. Brother, what is one piece of advice that you either, like one great piece of advice someone's given you or your go-to piece of advice that you'd like to give everybody, I'll let you choose one, you know?

David Priemer: 52:58

So in addition to the authenticity, which I think is important, you know, people often think about like, what is it that I should do? Like, what should I do? Like when I grow up or what should I do as my next career move? And the one piece of advice you know, I, I would say it's like, Rather than focus on it. And it's kind of funny. We were talking about, you know, how you describe what you do in terms of product. Like don't focus on the product. Don't focus on the job. Don't focus on the title, ask yourself, like, what do you want the parameters to be? Do you want to, you know, do you want to have freedom and flexibility to work on your own? Do you wanna wear sweat pants every day? Do you want to work an office building? You want to manage people, you will not want to manage people and for clues, cause some people are confused, then they say, well, I don't, I don't know. I'm trying to figure it out. Look back on your history now. So I'm 45 years old. When I now look back on, you know, 20 years ago and talking to 20 years ago, David, you know, I would say like take a look at the things that you love to do, forget what the job title was or what, cause that doesn't matter. What are the things, part of the job that you love to do? And how can you do more of those things, each subsequent job that you move to. And that I think ultimately will lead you on the path to a, what you're meant to do and B what you will be happiest. Doing it's like, look for that pattern. Look for that pattern. Don't worry about the titles, the, you know, the job of the company, just focusing on that, because at the end of the day, what do we all want? We want to be happy. We want to feel fulfilled. And you know, sometimes, you know, it's something you only get perspective on later on is someone telling, you know, like, look at the patterns, you know, of the thing you love to do. Don't don't obsess with like the title or the money or the job or anything like that.

Pablo Gonzalez: 54:31

Follow feels good. Can be more, couldn't agree. More David, before I ask you your last question, where do you know promote, promote your book, promote your website, promote your use of channels, right? I'm going to, I'm going to link to your blogs, cerebral selling your YouTube channel, your LinkedIn, your Instagram, your book title, but this is your moment. You're a stage or whatever you want to promote, you know, like where does somebody that if somebody just had their mind blown by this conversation, like I did, when I first heard you and like I am right now and wants to connect with you, what's the best place

David Priemer: 55:01

to get in contact with you? Well, look, you can always hit me up on LinkedIn. I always love when people, you know, reach out. So by all means, go and do that. but you know, if you want to access my content, you can find me. My website is cerebral selling all one word.com cerebral selling on YouTube and Instagram and Twitter as well. And my book is called sell the way you buy and it's available wherever you buy an Amazon people often go to, but wherever you buy books, you can get

Pablo Gonzalez: 55:24

it. Awesome, man, last question. I ask everybody, where do you find community?

David Priemer: 55:31

Oh, you know what, so one of the things I do I run a sales leadership meet up you know, it's a, it's, it's not like it's a member organization, but it's free. Like I don't charge anything. and I do it because sales leadership is such an important. Role leadership, coaching culture. It's something that is really hard to separately hard and something that a lot of organizations don't get any kind of training or coaching and investment in. And it can be a very lonely job, especially if you're the only one at your company. So I created a little community called the sales leadership mastermind, where I pull, you know, these leaders together. And we talk about everything from lack of sleep during the pandemic to crazy CEOs that have unrealistic revenue expectations. So I find a great deal of community in that group of sales leaders, because we're all going through a lot of the same thing.

Pablo Gonzalez: 56:20

Amazing man, David, this has been one of those moments where I'm just like super happy on the podcast here, right? Like. The, the ability to hear somebody that sounds really, really intriguing to you, reach out to them and have a conversation, and then come away from this conversation. Like, I want to be this guy's best friend. And I hope that we're friends after this is something that I just experienced and it's phenomenal, man. So like, I'm so glad that you came on. I'm really glad that you're putting content out there that led me to you, to your breadcrumbs and, and to this great advice in the way that you see things, man. And I really, really appreciate you. Haven't been here.

David Priemer: 56:52

Oh, look, man, it's my pleasure to be with you. And and your audience. This is actually, I enjoy this as an element of community as well, because what I've realized, especially connecting with business owners like me, like no, one's figured it out, right? We're all trying to figure it out. As the game is changing, we're all trying to help each other. And so I appreciate the service that you do putting this stuff out there and and keeping these sessions going. So this is, it's been a real pleasure for me to